Ok, so from the start when David posted his Firesale post there was something that didn't sit right about it with me. I kind of ignored it and didn't really thing too much about it, and even considered participating. But today I had a couple of minutes to organize my thoughts and get settled what it was that was bothering me. I'll comment more later, but for now I just wanted to post some links for you guys to read and consider and then we can discuss later.
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/fantasy/article/dump-trades-and-free-markets/
http://www.addictfantasysports.com/perspectives/article/1787
http://www.kffl.com/article.php/106432/236
There are a lot more articles that I found, but I'm not going to post all of them just to prove the point. I know there are articles that argue for the other side as well (one of them is linked in the kffl article above), but someone for "dumping" can post those.
I don't think it is insignificant that most of the duscussion about dumping is centered on fantasy baseball, or that Real Baseball has and continues to implement rules to regulate and limit as much as possible "dump trades". Trades like this are not a part of real football, and yes, I know FF isn't real football, but there's a general attitude in football that you play every game to win. Even when you're 1-14 like the Dolphins were 2 years ago, they were still playing that last game to win. It just seems contrary to the whole idea of fantasy football that a team should be allowed to just give up...even if it is to some benefit for next year.
If this was a 1 year league, and I was in last place, and decided to give up and not set my roster for the last 4 weeks, I think everyone would jump in and ask Pat as the LM to either get me to do it, or to set it for me. They would want this because they wouldn't want 1 teams playoff possibilities to be decided by another team giving up. It's not only about what benefit David is getting for next year, it affects other teams in the league. If David gives up, and hands Wally a W this week, one team is automatically out of the playoffs.
Gotta go, but there'll be plenty of discussion I think (hope).
I am inclined to agree.
ReplyDeleteI believe that this is a shortsighted argument.
ReplyDeleteFor everyone in this league, the goal is not 1 year. It can't be. The goal is the three year prize. That's what really matters. So for those of you who have lucked in to good fortune and health on your teams, GREAT! Go and try to win. For me the best thing for me to do is to set myself up to have a chance next year, and more importantly the three year goal.
Of course you guys don't like it. It leaves the possibility of me being competitive in the following years in this league.
What I'm doing is not what Josh is correlating it with for a one year league. That's giving up. I'm doing the EXACT opposite of giving up. I'm fighting for the best chance to be a winner.
Either way. I don't think you can call this dumping. I'm not giving up a quality keeper player for many solid players.
Secondly, who defines what exactly is a 'dump trade'? Ultimately, it's subjective. Ultimately, there are no hard rules. This is where the danger comes in. Any trade someone doesn't like becomes subject to veto. If I trade Andre Johnson for 2 mid level players is that a 'dump trade'? What if it addresses my needs? What if it doesn't? Who defines anything?
With all that being said, I agree with a stipulation on the pro-dumping article on the KFFL website. The integrity of the trade must be examined. To guard against collusion, which could be the case in a 1 year league. In this example, I'm not even receiving top quality keepers in return. I think as long as everyone seeks to aggressively improve their own chances of success, we don't really have a right to say anything. No collusion is going on, which is the ONLY reason to interfere.
There's my thoughts. Let's treat this league like a keeper league, and decide that the next couple years matter too.
First off, I would like to start off by saying my opinion isn't a direct result of my current standing in the league, rather a concern I have for all teams going forward. I do agree with Josh and John about "huge" dumpoffs and how that would create an unfair advantage to teams that could benefit from such a trade. However, I feel like teams at the bottom should be able to make moves that can improve their teams into the future, as this is a 3 year league. I feel that if a bottom team cannot make moves to improve their team, it will be much more difficult for those teams to close the gap to the top teams. What do you think should be done to prevent huge dumpoffs while still allowing bottom feeding teams to improve their teams? Limit the number players involved in a trade, having the league vote on these types of trades, discussing the trade with the commish first, etc.?? I would like to get more information so we could possibly come up with a solution to this problem. Also, I think it should be mentioned we should stop trying to draw a comparison between real football and this keeper league... as many things such as a higher value of return yards are not "realistic". Hopefully we can figure a quick solution so bottom feeding teams can get trades through by Friday.
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